After You've Gone

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kcox
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After You've Gone

Post by kcox »

I've been fooling around with Stephane Wrembel's suggestions of the arpeggios approach in his book, but I've run into a bit of a problem with the following section of After You've Gone:

Am | E7 | Am | Cm6 | G | B7 | Em7 | A7

I've tried generalizing it to something like:

C | C | Cm | Cm| G | G | A7 | A7

But other than the G it doesnt sound quite right to me. Any suggestion?

Best,

Kevin
c'est chaud!!!!!!!
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justjack
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Post by justjack »

Can you give an idea of what his approach is? It seems like he's suggesting you generalize to the 'home' key, maybe? If so, one thing that jumps out is that in those first 3 bars you match 1) Am to C, which seems fine, 2) E7 to C, which could clash-if you're thinking in terms of C, you'll be hitting Em7 notes; you might try something in terms of A there as E7 is the V in that key, 3) Am to Cm, which would make more sense as Am to C, Am being the relative minor. On the other hand, I think Charlie Parker often used the Am to Cm type idea.

Of course, if all this has nothing to do with Stephane's ideas, just ignore it. I'd like to hear more about his method, though!

Best,
Jack.
kcox
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Post by kcox »

Hey Jack,

The method has little to do with theoretical approach to chords, it's just a simple arpeggios approach where in learning to improv you practice running the related arpeggios over chord changes in various positions.

For this song I *could* just run each arpeggios as written, but since they are only one bar long I was hoping to generalize them. Stephane doesn't really talk about that in his book, and I don't know much theory so, well...I posted!

:D

Kevin
c'est chaud!!!!!!!
Paganini
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Post by Paganini »

Kevin,

I would approach it different if I were you.


Am | E7 | Am | Cm6 | G | B7 | Em7 | A7


For Am/E7/Am I would stay in Am but for the E7 play the G#-note
Then play a Cm-arpeggio, For G/B7/Em7 you can stay in the key of G (do not only play arpeggios, it gets borring), for A7 you can play the arpegio of A7.

I don't say it should be like this but this is just my approach.

regards
Arjen
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joef
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Post by joef »

Am | E7 | Am | Cm6 | G | B7 | Em7 | A7


The last (A7 above) chord is commonly played as a diminished seventh eg C sharp dim as this leads back into the G chord in the following bar.

regards

Joe
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Wallace
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Post by Wallace »

I'd say learn to play the tune first. Once you can do that you can gradually add/leave out notes using the scales or arps as a rough guide. Above all experiment. You'll soon hear if it sounds wrong but what you will end up with is a solo that doesn't loose track of the song you're playing; a problem that often occurs when too much theory and not enough 'ear' is used.
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djangology
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Post by djangology »

yes, personally i would follow Wallaces advice... :-)

my approach would be to think of the Am as the ii chord in the key of G and pretend the Cm6 is a Am7b5 and therefore also a ii chord in G (sorta???) ... at least when you think this way then you can just relax and pretend like it makes sense...
Mike V
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Post by Mike V »

My 2 cents is to play it as you first wrote it out:

Am | E7 | Am | Cm6 | G | B7 | Em7 | A7

Think of Am | E7 | Am as the key of Am and use the A harmonic minor scale. Don't worry about the E7, just play out of A harmonic minor.

For Cm6, play whatever you just played over the last Am, but move it up a minor third. This is a standard swing era harmonic device.

G | B7 | Em7 | A7 is the hook and its hardest part of the tune. The only way to master this is to play it over and over and over. Make up an etude playing over and over those four chords and eventually you'll get the hang of it. There are many great sounding lines that just fall out of playing the arpeggios. Add a little phrasing and you'll come up with great stuff you can use even when the chords aren't G | B7 | Em7 | A7.
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djangology
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Post by djangology »

G | B7 | Em7 | A7 is the hook and its hardest part of the tune
you can also think of the G, the Em7, and the A7 as being the I, the vi , and the V in the key of G.

so, in effect, other than the cm6 and the b7 in the song, the tune just keeps modulating back and forth. first half Am and the second half in G (or Em)

actually, the magical thing here is that the same diminished scale that fits over that B7 is the same one that fits over the Cm (or F7 chord)
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Post by jackthe hack »

i am new today,my first forum.i came aross this researching a song i had to do.django stumped me.i couldnt get any free tech anywhere.so i figured him out,it is quit simple......firstly i noticed that he plays the exact notes played in the chord in he solos over, with exception to flourishes.he doest play all the note in the scale just these ones.Example Cmaj7,C E G B,not A OR D OR F,ONLY TOUCH THESE NOTES IN TRILLS AND TRIPLETTES.if the chord is played twice,start a diminished scale in the next bar, on 1st or 2nd string and try to land on one of the major 3rds(scale notes) of the chord that is coming up in the next bar.if Cmin7 the C Eb G Bb.get it?use and string together these broken scales called.......arpeggios.
next, the fingering of they phrases,use only two finger or it wont come off right.


C maj 7 Cmin 7
--------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------
---------------------9---------12---- ----------------------8---------------11-----
-----------------10--------12-------- -----------------10--------------12------------
-------------9------------------------ -------------8-----------------------------
----7----10--------------------------- ------6--10-----------------------------------
--8------------------------------------- ---8-----------------------------------------
add neighbour notes to any of the above singles for flavor...........there is more
i am new
kcox
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Post by kcox »

Thanks for all the replies, guys.

Jack, that's exactly the approach I've been using.

Mike, I rarely think about repeating patterns as the chords modulate...it's a great trick that I should try using more often. Thanks for the ideas.

Jon Thor, I'm going to try that Cm/B7 diminished arpeggios idea, too.

Best,

Kevin
c'est chaud!!!!!!!
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